How to thaw poultry: ignore government
I always thaw my turkey on the counter. I put it in a roasting pan, to catch the juices, and more importantly, to prevent the cats from nibbling late at night. But with the Canadian Thanksgiving on Oct. 8, Health Canada has come out with its latest orders to Canadians, based on bureaucracy, not science, or even the best available evidence.
"Health Canada would like to remind all Canadians that there are simple steps they can take to help ensure their turkey feast is a safe one."
Food safety is not simple. If it was there wouldn't be "between 11 million and 13 million cases of food-related illnesses in Canada every year" as the Heath Canada press release states.
Or consumers are just really stupid.
But more baffling is the lack of scientific references for Health Canada's recommendations.
They say,
"Do not thaw your turkey at room temperature. Thaw turkey in the refrigerator or in cold water."
The water bit could lead to cross-contamination. And as myself and co-authors wrote in 2003,
"While several methods including thawing on the counter at ambient temperatures can be employed for thawing turkey, however, it is adequate cooking, validated with a meat thermometer, that is the more critical step."
The Health Canada advice got it right with the use a meat thermometer bit. But that's it. Messages like consumers are too stupid to safely thaw meat on the counter are patronizing, patriarchial, and certainly not effective. And when Health Canada and the groups they cite, like the Partnership for Consumer Food Safety Education -- snappy name there -- provide references in peer-reviewed journals, then maybe the rest of us will take them seriously.
Until then, they're just hacks, offering advice based on bureaucracy, not evidence.
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BarfBlog -
October 6, 2007 7:14 PM
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BarfBlog -
October 13, 2008 6:33 PM
Thanksgiving has always been my favorite holiday – a celebration of the harvest with food, friends and family. Canadian Thanksgiving is today, so in an effort to enhance Canadian Studies, or at least the ability of Kansans to be able...
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I have a difficult time accepting food safety advice from someone that comments "to prevent the cats from nibbling late at night". Are we talking about a food preparation surface on which cats are allowed to walk/lay/groom, maybe immediately after a trip to the litter box?
I do not allow cats on the counter. I also wouldn't allow my kids to do lots of things; things they may do it when I'm not around.
The cat comment specifically relates to some observational research done in Australia several years ago, in which household cats were often found on counters in the middle of the night, especially if food was left out. So I enclose the thawing turkey.
Hi
I have been a health inspector/food safety specialist for thirty years. Not much education but I read a bit.
I often fight with my colleagues over some food safety practices as some of them (the practices that is) do not seem to be based on science and I like to cause havoc amongst bureaucrats too. Thawing things on the counter is one I like to use to get a rise out of them. None of them have offered this argument but I am curious how you would respond. What about Staph or other heat stable toxin producers? Surely if water is a potential source of cross contamination so is the "staff" that processed the birds in the first place.
Just because the people you refer to tow the party line (what else are they supposed to do?) doesn't mean they are ignorant hacks. It is all a matter of context. If I am writing a piece I would say defrost in the refrigerator probably due to lack of room, if I am speaking and am able to explain the mattter fully I might get into defrosting a little better. As you say it is not a simple matter.
Love your show (and T shits oops shirts)
Once again, the elustrious Dr. Powell goes on the offensive to increase the hits on his own website by bad-mouthing the Canadian guv. I guess it worked, because here I am. However, once I finish writing this paragraph, I will be unsubscribing from your FSNet listserv. I've had my fill of baseless rants and riveting stories about food safety at KSU sporting events.
Hope you enjoy your turkey, you academic hack.
I'm pretty shocked by this extremely unprofessional rant you've posted; especially since you're putting people's safety at risk in order to vent your personal views.
Since I won't be able to take anything you say seriously after this, I will be unsubscribing from FSNet.
I am a health inspector in Washington State where thawing on the counter is not allowed.
I went to try to read the article to get some more background on your argument, but not going to pay $20 just to read it... My question is, are you referring specifically to home turkey cooking?
This is certainly not a practice that would be allowed in a restaurant kitchen...we want to make things easy and straight-forward using proven methods of safety. Food thawed on the counter warms up on the outside while the inside is still cold; so there is opportunity for bacteria to grow before the turkey is fully defrosted... right? I am interested in your evidence that this is not so.
I have responded to many of the points raised in these comments, but it's too big to post as a comment. So it's available as it's own blog post at:
http://barfblog.foodsafety.ksu.edu/2007/10/articles/food-safety-communication/thawing-and-cooking-turkey/index.html
I'm not sure why you are getting flak from some of these people who seem intent on unsubscribing. You are completely correct and the rant is warranted. There are a lot of government regulations in a variety of areas that are not evidence-based or are poorly done. People who work in, or with, government agencies should be well aware of this and why this occurs, and it is irresponsible for the government do this. Even the U.S. FDA recommendations for thawing are incorrect.
The science actually indicates that thawing on a counter is perfectly safe and is apparently safer than in a refrigerator due to the extra time needed. For more details and references, see http://www.foodsafetynetwork.ca/en/link-details.php?a=4&c=23&sc=187&id=117 .
"based on bureaucracy, not science, or even the best available evidence."
Where's yours?
Robert:
Please see:
http://www.foodsafety.ksu.edu/en/link-details.php?a=4&c=23&sc=187&id=117
http://barfblog.foodsafety.ksu.edu/2007/10/articles/food-safety-communication/thawing-and-cooking-turkey/
best regards
dp
can u give me aswer of this qus plz
how should poultry be thawed? explain